Table of Contents
Introduction
There has been alot of talking recently about what is an acceptable form of tribute after a war is lost by one party, and when a certain amount of raiding is classified as harassment. This post will explain both points separately, as they are closely related.
Tribute
To begin with tribute, players may demand tribute from other players if a war is lost. Alot of ridiculously large tributes have been demanded, so we decided to come up with a “community standard”. Many of you know we internally could not come up with a solution, so we held an improv meeting on the TS. This rule is the result of directly talking with a wide range of players from raiders to farmers.
Note: running around demanding X amount of Regals to not raid people every week is thus now against the rules.
You may demand tribute from a faction in the form of a treaty. This treaty must last at least 75 days. In this period the attacker may not enemy the person who lost the war, or participate in any hostile actions against this faction. The defender, for whatever reason, may however cancel the truce and attack the faction they lost a war to at any time. This will nullify the agreement and the attacker may declare war again. There is a maximum amount of Regals one may demand. The system works with increments of 20 Regals per member above 10 members. To explain this more thoroughly, below are the brackets.
- Bracket 1 = 1 to 9 players = 1o Regals per player in the faction
- Bracket 2 = 10 to 19 players = 20 Regals per player in the faction
- Bracket 3 = 20 to 29 players = 40 Regals per player in the faction
- Bracket 4 = 30 to 39 players = 60 Regals per player in the faction
- Bracket 5 = 40 to 49 players = 80 Regals per players in the faction
- Bracket 6 = 50 or more players = 100 Regals per player in the faction
Kicking members during the surrender or abusing open factions and spamming alts into them before declaring war will result in IP bans/server bans for circumventing rules. If you suspect either happening, report it straight away.
Some examples:
- Faction A declares war on Faction B. After some time, Faction B loses the war. Faction B has 23 members. 23 is between 20 and 29, so Faction B falls under bracket 3. Bracket 3 maintains 40 Regals per player, so 23 players times 40 is 920. 920 Regals is the maximum Faction A may demand for a truce that lasts at least 75 days.
- Faction C declares war on Faction D. After some time, Faction C loses the war. Faction C has 9 members. 9 is between 1 and 9, so Faction C falls under Bracket 1. Bracket 1 maintains 10 Regals per player, so 9 players times 1 is 9. 9 Regals is the maximum faction D may demand for a truce that lasts at least 75 days.
There are some exceptions to this rule:
- The losing side of the war may always barter for a shorter truce. If they only want a 30 day truce, that is their right, but only if the winner agrees.
- The losing side of the war may barter resources instead of money. They must then come up with a sum of resources equal to the Regals that the winning faction would demand. Because there is no stable market price, we will not define a max amount of diamonds, this must be conceived by the loser. The winner must however accept the deal, and if they do not you must still pay the Regals.
- Just because you win a war does not mean you have to demand Regals. We as the staff encourage you to demand political gestures such as: Placing your flag on their base, demanding they join your empire, demanding they merge with your faction, demanding they publicly surrender on the forum, etc, etc. The loser must however agree to these different means of surrendering, if they do not then you may only demand the Regals.
While above points state we encourage people to ask for “Regal free demands”, this does not mean you can continue to heap up demands. If a faction offers you the legal limited Regal amount for a peace treaty, you must accept it or drop the peace demands to something they find acceptable. You as an attacking faction cannot continue a war if the losers are suing for peace and you refuse to accept their offerings made according to the rules defined here.
To all situations, the right of surrender applies. If a losing faction calls for a surrender, the winning factions must immediately state demands and cease raiding for an acceptable period of time. This period depends on the factions, but usually means “until the faction leader has seen the demands and taken them into consideration or consultation with his faction officers”. This period may take several hours or days, but never more then 5 days. The faction asking for demands may decide to deny the peace treaty and continue defending themselves.
If you as a losing faction have heard the demands and they are within the stipulations mentioned here, you have the right to reject these demands. This however means that the faction who made the demands may raid you indefinitely until you accept to the demands.
We encourage everyone to maintain the friendly atmosphere on the server, and try to settle things in a civil order. Raiding is an integral part of the medieval universe, but when it starts to “hurt” people’s fun in the game it should stop.
After peace has been made, both sides, both the losing and winning, may not enter in a mutual or one way flame war on the forum or in game. It is expected both parties do the honorable thing and refrain from abusing the truce by trash-talking one another because they cannot retaliate in a physical manner.
Harassment
Harassment has been thrown around alot lately for all the wrong reasons. It’s a running joke in the administration team that the majority of the players classify stepping on someone’s toes classifies as harassment. While this is an exaggeration, it shows how many appeals of harassment we receive on a regular basis. This part will explain when you can and cannot call harassment on a faction.
Harassment can be called if:
- A faction who is waging war with you refuses to make official demands after you have asked for them and are considering surrendering.
- A faction has no roleplay reasons or logical reasons to attack you, but simply does so out of personal spite. Note: admins will always be the judge of what is spite attacking and what is not.
- A faction raids you in a trolling-raid with no particular reason other then non-targeted killing.
- Players raiding staff members for no other reason then the fact that they are staff. (“lulz 2 raid staff lolomgz” is very annoying to deal with for us)
Please refrain from calling harassment unless you are actually being harassed. Being raided 2 days in a row, or 7 days does not classify as harassment, especially since you can ask for a truce way before the 3rd day has even started.
As a general last closing note, we ask all players to show some common sense, some empathy and understanding, and to refrain from being cruel or mean. We may take action against a faction displaying excessive hostility towards other players if we deem it necessary to maintain the status quo of the server.
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Discussion
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So this looks like it will effectifly ban all forms of bandits in a sense does it not? Players that would normaly look for other players to hunt in the wilderness while roaming and attack people they happened across (in wilderness or in factions). Correct me if I am wrong but would this now be a form of harrassment since it is non-targeted killing of players?
No, people who are not part of a faction and as such circumvene the whole faction versus faction system have no application to these rules whatsoever. These rules are purely faction vs. faction,
But what f a player is in a faction but solely goes out exploring, the faction may/may not know if this, and just attacks people he sees either starting up or have unprotected areas, as a bandit would. This should be allowed right, since it is RPing.
While on one level I love this… I do feel a tad bad for my job, as there will be less bandits to hunt… Demanding money should be controlled, but not raiding in itself. That takes it a tad too far in the other direction…
For without evil, cruel bastards, where is the fun?
And if your concerned about ruining another player’s experience with constant raids, don’t be. When word get’s out some factions are attacking random people, they get enemied by half the server, who take it in turns to punish them via raiding.
I feel the harassment portion of this should be tweaked….
While I personally dislike raiding in any form, I do agree that the harassment is a bit much. Perhaps have it specified to faction on faction killing? With a note saying that leaving a faction, raiding, and then returning is not allowed?
As far as I am concerned the harassment regulations are light. We are getting endless reports of people who have been raided by the same person twice in a period of 2 days already jumping on the harassment claim bandwagon.
We want to stop the endless flood of harassment claims that aren’t actually harassment at all.
Is it alright to dynmap hunt? see who’s shown on the dynmap and sneak up on them and kill them (only once mind you) even if they are in faction land requiring you to enemy them?
I was kind of curious about this as well. If not there will be a lot of people who either get banned or find something else to do. I personally know quite a few people that do this.
Just a question to clarify….is someone allowed to ask for the max silver tribute as well as the other non-monetary stuff such as flag raising? Or if you ask for the max silver tribute can you not demand anything else?
I feel the kicking thing might be an issue, for example i kick alot of players from my faction for not following my orders during said raid.
Also, does this mean they cant have their demands have to be silver related. Like they cant demand you becoming a subfac or wanting dimonds etc.
N/m to my second question it seems i missed a paragraph.
Also, i thought the admin considered raiding to the point where the losing faction even do anything was considered harassment?
Also the bracket of silver being raised for bigger factions, i dont see how that makes any sense….
That seems like it would be in place as more of a reward for defeating a bigger challenge. Say if a faction had 20 people it would be much harder to raid so the reward is higher then say a faction with 4 people.
thing is most bigger factions have less money seeing as most of them are filled with new ppl who barely have 3 silver to their name.
It kinda makes the demands impossible.
So Alamut enemying random allies is harrasment now?…
No.
I personally think this is a good idea, in exception of the bracket of silver demands. I think this is going to allow factions to attack larger factions, but make sure that most of the players are inactive most of the time. This might be stopped if you offer a definition of “defeat” so players can’t kill 5 people in a faction of 50 and demand 500 silver. But without any help, this will allow tricky players to slip around this rule and demand absurd amounts of silver for killing small amounts of people, or “winning a war”.
In the end this seems like its going to be really hard to enforce. You could say you can only request silver per player that participated in the defence of the faction. But then it becomes more of an honor system because you will get players logging off to keep the ransom/bounty whatever you want to call it lower.
“This might be stopped if you offer a definition of “defeat” so players can’t kill 5 people in a faction of 50 and demand 500 silver”
I fail to see the problem. If this is the problem they should kick inactive players.
May I call harassment on someone even though it happened a month ago and I have no proof?
No.
Are raids considered wars?
yes
Well kinda, raid is a word thats thrown around alot, the defination of a raid, is to steal. Raid gets used a term for most wars on this server, so technicly most raids that occur arent even raids due to stealing not being the exact goal.
A lot of detail was put into the whole silver demand chart but not enough attention was given to the actual circumstances to determine a win/loss situation. If after three days of being attacked a faction declares itself the winner for excellent defense and slaughtering all the attackers and calls it there but the attacker never agrees to it out of blind spite or intent to defraud. Problem is it can easily be drawn out by a less then honorable attacker refusing to ever loose, even after having its champions fight a duel to determine a result, and then not acknowledging the result if not in their favor despite cheating and turning a one on one honor duel into a 3 on 1 fight and still loosing. At this point, in my honest opinion, it becomes harassment due to daily attacks, for several hours preventing players from enjoying the game due to the attacks during their limited playtime, which they no longer care to bother with because it serves no purpose because they will not admit defeat even when they are bested. Giving license to continue to attack someone, even after having been beaten back, until the defender just doesn’t care anymore, for the sole purpose of extortion of silver/items seems like a loop hole that can and will be exploited and result in player frustration and rampant abuse leading to overall detriment of the server community and a thinning of the rich community we are all here to enjoy. Please take this into consideration as it is the difference in mentality on this server, from most other factions servers, which makes it so great. It only takes a few rotten apples to ruin the pie.
How players end their wars is not our concern, and we don’t have the resourced to keep everyone’s hand.
I feel as this will give most factions a reason to flood the CM/GM’s with even more harassment claims since now they can just point to the website and say “hey its illegal so stop or get banned” because you know half of them won’t even read this whole thing.
I mean my faction (Saun) raids all the time but we don’t go into the realm of harassment. We pick a target, attack, then pick another one. We don’t spend hours upon hours attacking one faction because we ourselves wouldn’t want that done to us.
But then again we have raided one faction and was there less than five minutes before they screamed for the mods claiming harassment, so its a issue that needs to be addressed in game as well with the same answer from each CM/GM instead of fragmented answers.
What you describe isn’t lolraiding but “vikingraiding” and is completely legal.
Well good to know what we do is at least on the legal side
so if i think about joining the server in order to open a magetower, where i help people of all factions e.g. treating their wounds but i´m in no faction, can i call harrassment because a faction starts destroying my home because they want the stuff i i have?
I was reading the online rules and I couldn’t find anything about sexual harassment. I suggest somebody look into this.
Ok, I live in an Orc war camp, I read the orc lore and it says, “Orcs enjoy waging war, especially against the Elves” Would this be a valid reason?